Dr.SHIVA™ – WHAT IS AI? The Truth About Artificial Intelligence

Dr.SHIVA™ – WHAT IS AI? The Truth About Artificial Intelligence

Hello welcome everyone this is Dr Shivaya dure today's talk is really About artificial intelligence AI which Is the acronym many of you have heard About this thing called AI but may not Fully understand what it is except Probably thinking there's going to be a Bunch of machines which are going to Take over your lives we're going to have Robots walking around And and that's you know the idea that You have r2d2s running around or the Little robot that vacuum cleans for you But today we're going to really get into Different aspects of AI you know sort of The popular idea of what AI is the much More technical knowledge what AI is you Know I've been involved in AI research Since the 80s you know since I came to MIT it's been one of my passions I built A very large company out of it called Echo mail where we used to do AI for Email analytics made a ton of money Doing that so it's an area I know a lot About and it's an area that I want to be Able to share with you for various Reasons because I believe that the Mainstream media as usual will always Distill something to something sort of Useless that you may not really Understand the experts will try to Mislead you into whatever the flavor of The day is but what we want to do on This podcast is to really give you the

Foundations of AI and artificial Intelligence so that's what I want to Talk about and obviously Marcelo and Richard you know you guys are Represented in many ways of sort of Popular culture so you know you guys Feel free to step in and jump in on any Of these questions and say I'll go Deeper but the field of AI is really About fundamentally how do you take Human intelligence and replicate it Using machines that's what it's really About so so some very interesting terms I just used human intelligence the Primary word there is intelligence in Podcast two we talked about intelligence From a systems perspective so one of the Things we really need to do is Define What is intelligence you know before we Talk about human intent intelligence or Artificial intelligence and I'll get Into some very deep issues of what is The difference between a human and a Machine and even more deeper aren't we All machines so are we what is it Between artificial intelligence and Human intelligence we'll get into this But fundamentally think about a Quote-unquote intelligent activity a Human does and being able to replicate That with the machine right so if you Want to go to some very simple ideas of This you could think about a calculator As a form of artificial intelligence

Right when I was growing up in India my Great-grandfather could do you know Fractional multiplication in his head You know all different kinds of Fractional multiplication because he had To know how to do that when he was Farming and you had to for Commerce Reasons a lot of mathematics really came Out of Commerce we didn't really need Mathematics until we started to do Commerce you had things like the Abacus That people use for doing calculations Faster when Computing came we started Developing chips we started Outsourcing Some of those computations to a thing Called a calculator and so the Calculator could do you know you know Three million 225 215 times 10 million 315 235 you know those kind of things Fast now we could do it by paper but we Outsource that kind of computation which Was a human intelligent activity to a Machine so you could think about a Calculator it's a form of a machine that Was able to do those kinds of Computations it was a form of AI so what Is AI from a technical perspective and When did it really start taking off There's a field called cybernetics Which came out during the 20s 30s in That period and led by a guy called Norbert weiner there were many other People if you go to MIT and you walk Down the Halls when I first came to MIT

Called the infinite Corridor there's a Picture of this guy who looks like your Typical nerd Professor is a goatee Glasses a little bit of a punch belly And a suit and that was Norbert weiner Norbert weiner is known as the father of Cybernetics or modern AI And Norbert weiner is the one who Started looking at the human body or the Human being as a multi-tiered system It's a electrical system we have Electricity running through us it's a Magnetic system it's an electro Mechanical system it's multiple systems And the idea was could you start Building an engineering field and how You start developing machines which Could replicate human function and that Was a field of cybernetics and Cybernetics brought in many many Different disciplines not only physics But it started bringing in a whole new Field called information Theory led by a Guy called Claude Shannon it also Brought in the field of systems theory Uh General systems theory thermodynamic Theory but it was a exciting period Because it brought together many many Different fields because if you're going To recreate something like the human Being you have to bring in multiple Fields and so interesting enough after Norbert weiner really pioneered this Field he wrote a number of essays

Talking about how horrible artificial Intelligence and cybernetics would be For Humanity what types of machines were They building back then in 2013 . yeah So so they were trying to do large-scale Computing machines right they were Starting to get into Vision systems so One of the early problems in artificial Intelligence was Vision so think about It this way I've used this in many of my Examples when I try to explain what Pattern recognition is ai's become a Buzzword but the real technology behind AI is a field called pattern analysis or Pattern recognition so let's think about Richard and and Marcelo are out a bunch Of cavemen you know sitting around a Fire and the snake comes at you okay Well you have two choices run you know Or let the snake pass by so how do you Make that decision it's also a field Called decision theory in fact I might Add a whole Lab still has a lab which Just recently merging called laboratory For information and decision systems Lids so the fundamental thing is how do You make a decision snake is coming at You how do you make a decision well Human beings over many Millennia Developed a way to you know sit quietly Even snake came it's it's not poisonous Or flee or beat the hell out of the Snake right that was a process that Human beings went through or they

Survived or they died right so there was Something in the human brain which Helped us do this well and it probably It went something like this Snake came at you Which had a diamond head right and you Thought it was a nice pet you pet it it Bit you and you died okay so you you Died off yeah and let's say Richard's Clan continued to live because they said Wait a minute diamond shaped head I saw That before and it bit someone else and It caused him so that knowledge in Richard's Clan was passed on and he Probably taught it to other people so They had transfer of information from One Um you know being to another and by the Way culture is ultimately a transfer of Knowledge do you think there was ever Like a natural instinct of people just Getting a feeling that that's like it's That's a great question yeah that looks Or something right away right the very First time right so there there are Theories in behavioral genetics which Say some of this may be hard-coded it's Not learned it's hard-coded and the more Interesting thing is that the genes Myself can pass on learning they can Take learn something and pass it on gets Into a whole nother again that's another Podcast but the issue is there was a set Of knowledge and learning

That Richard learned that Marcelo didn't Let's say caveman Richard versus caveman Marcelo and that was passed on so people Got very good at identifying poisonous Snakes and non-poisonous snakes and they Made a decision those decisions were Made right So and you can apply this kind of Knowledge transfer and this kind of Learning patterns and passing them on to In many many different ways you know it Could also be for foraging for food Mushrooms some mushrooms you eat they Can kill you other mushrooms you eat and You die right so you could argue that The existence of Human beings today was through a whole History of learning decisions and and Then using those decisions to pass on to Others and so how does all of this occur And this was really the question of Cybernetics or pattern analysis how does This occur how does knowledge acquired How do we learn learning and knowledge Acquisition were some of the most Important things because you have to Acquire knowledge and you have to learn And you have to get better and better Doing doing it so just think about Forget the word AI just think about this Area of pattern analysis and how that Took place so I've shared with you how My grandmother could observe someone's Face and look at the patterns of that

Face and figure out if the person had a Liver issue or a kidney issue or a heart Issue Etc well that was a pattern Analysis problems in fact the ancient Rishis of India when they were in the Woods they would analyze all sorts of Patterns they would look at the patterns Of plants you know they're Leaf shapes And they would and they documented these Very very in beautiful you know detail So they knew these sets of plants where Plants that supported liver function or Kidney function or this and they learned This over time and they enumerated it And eventually they built it into a and We'll talk about that when when you Bring up the point Marcelo um maybe you Know right away so people say you know You know repetition is a mother of skill So there is an aspect of learning that Takes place the more you do something it Becomes intuitive everyone thinks oh Intuition is something like magic well It turns out the more you do something Your brain actually learns and it gets Faster and faster doing that and that Was the basis of one of the tools of Artificial intelligence or pattern Analysis called neural networks and We'll talk about that all right but the Bottom line is there's a learning Phenomenon that takes place that you Pass on and and that determines how Successful you are so in so in that 30s

Period a lot of this was driven frankly By War right to create you know the 40s Were starting you know World War one and Two drove a lot of this and you're Saying the founder was warning he was Warning us of the dangers of cyber yeah Yeah yeah yeah so so Norbert weiner After he is considered a pioneer Actually warned people that we probably Should not do this because of the effect It would have on human labor it would Put lots of people out of work and that It may not actually give us a life that We actually deserve there are certain Things human beings enjoy doing like Physical labor that actually could be Beneficial for he wrote a set of essays On this did anyone take him serious or Was he I think some people did but you Have the march of the Military-industrial academic complex so Give you an example of this so so all Sorts of people got into pattern Analysis or again what we say is AI Today Sutton behavioral psychologists Got into it now one of the very famous Or inFAMOUS people I don't really care For a guy called BF Skinner Skinner is Known as the school of Behavioral Psychology he made a lot of inroads to The military and the Navy because he Proposed the you know the the pain Reward model right the way you uh train Animals or people is you give them pain

Or you give them reward yeah so when People are designing missiles to go from Point A to point B remember if you Launch a missile from point A you want It to go exactly to point B well so and This was the bases what are called Cruise missiles so what the military did At one point this is before Computing Really took off is that they designed a Missile and inside the missile they put A TV monitor and the TV monitor had a Line between point a and point B okay so The TV monitor literally had point a Point B and a line Connecting Point a And point B and they put a pigeon inside The missile and the pigeon had an Electrode uh conductor connected to its Beak and the pigeon was taught when and By the way so you had the actual line Where the missile should travel and then Through a gyroscope where the missile Was actually going and the pigeon was Taught if the if the second line Deviated from the first line to peck on The monitor which gave a feedback so the Missile would make adjustments to get Back to its gold this was basically Before inertial guidance oh yeah all Right so basically they were using a Learning algorithm in this case the Algorithm was a pigeon it wasn't on a Computer and this is how they they did Before we had inertial guidance and now We have more sophisticated stuff right

With a cruise missile we actually are Mapping the terrain and the missile is All automated and that's a form of Artificial intelligence is following a Pattern but the concept of using animals Or other people to automate things Faster is is the whole history of Artificial intelligence you can even Think about AI as being when we went From the when the when the industrial Era started you have a manufacturing Line right you want to produce a paper Clip right instead of one person doing It by hand you started setting up a Manufacturing line one person simply you Know one set of people simply got the Steel ready right another set of people Cut it another set of people you know Wound it up right another set of people Packaged it now that may not sound like AI because you don't see a non-human Being used but in many ways that was the Foundations of AI because you use Carbon-based creatures called human Beings but you organize them in a very Systematic way to do very particular Things it's a using pattern recognition Well well not only pattern Reckless but But separation of labor for very Particular tasks and then as machines Could do some some of those things on an Assembly line you started replacing Pieces of that right so I think the the General thing I think something quite

Different than you'll hear anywhere in Any other podcast You're Going to Hear I Want to define AI not as a function of a Non-carbon-based machine but AI in the Concept of how you take some function That human beings do and how whether we Use a human being or a non-human being How it is systematized so you can get Better efficiency that's really a much More broader definition of AI so I would Argue when we started creating the Manufacturing line you know having Giving people very specific things to do That was a form of AI but we were just Using human beings to do very particular Things versus the individual doing Everything end to end yeah okay so Because then once you've figured out That system then you start replacing Pieces with machines right so think About the Ford Motor Company or Chrysler Or how they build cars initially you Know I guess you know what Henry Ford Fundamentally did you could call Henry Ford he's not known as a builder of the Car everyone gets destroying he's known Actually as a father of manufacturing Line where he wanted to create a car That everyone could buy but what he did Was he created the manufacturing line he Systematized a process so people are Doing pieces and then as you see that Advanced and when machines came and Computing came you started replacing so

You had maybe the machine automatically Paint it had Vision systems which could Automatically paint then you had Automatic robots which did which did the Bolt right screwing Etc but the notion Of AI is not just transferring it to a Machine but it's about figuring out a Process to do things faster and faster And faster and faster it just so happens You know we start calling it artificial When we transfer that knowledge to a Non-carbon based entity you know but you Have we have to look at it really at the History and that's what cybernetics was Doing so you know when I saw my Grandmother look at someone's face and Understand their that face and be able To say that person has this issue and Then she would make a decision of what Combination of herbs to give that person To get them to the path to Healing that Was pattern analysis now in the Indian System for thousands of years they wrote A book called samudra collection which Literally had every feature in the face Drawn out very precisely if you see you Know a furrowing a line between the two Eyes that meant there was a liver issue If you see you know certain things under The eyes kidney issue if you see a spot On the nose that was typically a heart Issue right so they I mean I'm just Giving you the high level but they had Enumerated all these patterns so after a

While people studied those books and They learned but then they got better And better and better and it was no Longer doing it by Road they built their Own intuition because their own Computing took over and we'll talk about This when we talk about neural networks Interesting enough there was a in the Sloan management review which is an MIT Publication many years ago I think about Five or six years ago they wrote a Article on intuition which was really Looking at how do Chess Masters uh make Moves and if you've ever seen the old Pictures of Bobby Fischer where there's Like 50 people lined up and he just goes Table to table to table and he makes a Move like he's doing a ton of moves and He wins all the games well it turns out The difference between a chess master And a non-chess master is that chess Master over time has seen so many Patterns that it's automatic this Pattern make this move under this Pattern make this condition all Basically they're training their their Brain they don't even think about it Really it's what you call intuition Because well they are thinking but the Thinking is firing at a level that's Beyond the actual actual thinking at a Very step-by-step manner another way to Think about this is think about learning To ride a bike or learning to ski well

If you've never skied before you're up On that hill and you're learning to ski The teacher's telling you stuff you know You know put your pressure on your left Foot if you want to go to the right Right foot if you want to go to the left But when you first learned skiing you're Wobbling you're going all over the place You're falling down so there's this Process of learning that's taking place And then you look at an expert skier They're coming down the hill at 100 Miles an hour and they're making very Subtle movements finesse so what's the Difference the difference is there is Physically something that's differently Wired in the brain of these professional Skier versus the novice think about when You learn to bicycling right I mean Obviously something biochemically has Changed when you first learn and then Later on you're just bicycling you're Not even thinking about it even driving As well even driving so William James In fact there's a building if you're in Harvard Square called the William James Building which is named after William James is known as the father of American Psychology so William James wrote a very Famous essay called associative memory And what he conjectured this is before Neural Nets came was that if you look at When you learn something or when you Experience something that literally

Creates physical Connections in your Brain between brain centers so he had This notion that something was changing In the brain and he called it Associative memory so when you learn to Bicycling there are set of parts of your Brain which are actually instantiating Which means saving that learn knowledge In the brain it has to be safe right it Has to be stored that's like building Neuro Pathways neural Pathways so so but He was the one who came up with this Concept of associative memory around This time in the 40s there developed a Theory called neural networks and the Idea is people are saying well how does That learning occur like physically and Could we create computers which emulate Which means duplicate that kind of Knowledge So the idea was this imagine if you've Looked when you have time you can look At what are called neurons okay they're Nerve cells so you have two nerve cells And the nerve cells very much like other Cells have membranes they have a nucleus But neurons also have these things Called dendrites and axons which Interconnect okay well there's a sheath Called a myelin sheath which covers you Know the extensions of the neuron okay So it's been shown now that when you Learn something what actually grows is Not the nerve cell but it's the cabling

Between nerve cells so think about if You have a live wire in your home you Know you plug it in you know the copper Wire and then there's a plastic around It that's called the myelin sheath that Actually gets thicker and thicker and Thicker it's like when you work a muscle It's very interesting we all have the Same number of muscle cells when you're Born it's fixed for men for example and When you when you actually get stronger And you work out with weights you're Actually increasing the size of the Fibers okay so it turns out the myelin Sheath when you experience something is Actually getting bigger so among groups Of neurons the interconnections we talk About interconnections in podcasts too Is literally growing it's not the nerve Cells are growing but the Interconnections between the groups of Neurons actually grow and getting Stronger and getting stronger so so the Connection strength between neuron 1 and Neuron two let's say there's these two Neurons hanging out and your brain of You know many many neurons billions of Neurons and and these two neurons Involved in learning you to Bicycle well The connection between those neurons as You practice day one practice day two There there's actually a physical part Of your brain it's actually getting Stronger it's the connection strength so

What scientists did was they said well Could we do this on a computer so they That was the beginning of what are Called a and ends artificial neural Networks and so they literally created The mathematics and the Computing where They could input something into a I'm Going to call it a black box of neurons And an output came out and what they Would do is train these neurons so what They could do is give you a simple Example I worked on this many years ago By the way I I think I mentioned to you AI or pattern analysis it's been sort of The foundation field that I was always Interested in because I want to Understand my grandmother is able to do That pattern analysis so when I first Came to MIT one of the earliest projects I worked on this was 19 and for that Matter in 1978 when I was working at the University of Medicine Dentistry one of The things in using quote unquote AI or Pattern analysis was babies die in their Sleep some of them it's called sudden Infant vet syndrome all right and human Beings have five states of sleep we have REM sleep where we're you know having Dreams we have transition sleep we have Waking State anyway adults have five States of sleep and you could literally Map it on a over time if you look during A 24-hour day you could actually plot it Children babies however have six Stakes

Of sleep so we were trying to predict When these baby by the way sudden infant That syndrome was when a baby suddenly Stops breathing it's a very scary thing For parents and what happens if the baby Stops breathing if you shake the baby You can resuscitate them so the idea was Could we predict when a baby would go Into that sudden state of not breathing Which is called an apnea apnea so we had Montefiore Hospital in New York at the Time gave us 48 hours of sleep data so We literally had minute by minute by Minute the Sleep states of babies and we Also had when that baby stopped sleeping So I built some of the early algorithms To see if I could correlate the Sleep Patterns to a particular point when the Baby went stop breathing so you don't Look at like the minutes right before See what pattern that yeah so you look At the Historical patterns of sleep Patterns and so the idea was and we Built those so so I I built a whole Mathematics where because I had all this Historical data my system could learn From that and I could see if I could Predict a pattern and we got uh some Very interesting data there were Definitely certain patterns which were Correlated to the apnea and we published That in paper my point is that pattern Analysis allowed us to make it a Decision and Technologies like these

Could get input into a shaking crib for Example so if you detected a sleep Pattern you automatically shake a That was the action okay okay is that What they do nowadays well there's very That's one of the methodologies you can Do right or you can set off an alarm my Point is that that was an example this Was when I was 14 before I built the First email system that's what I was Working on but it was using mathematics To look at a pattern now when you look At these patterns what you're trying to Do is you're trying to find out is a Recurring pattern and the math which I Can't get into in a podcast like this is Known as statistics so statistics is Where you're looking for particular Patterns probability of these patterns It's probability and statistics Fundamentally yeah and in probability And statistics you can have a single Input or multiple inputs and multiple Outputs in this case what we're looking At was you know the sleep pattern and We're looking at actually there's six Patterns right so you have six inputs Potentially and you're looking for the Output of two potential outputs which Means the baby stop breathing or it's Continuing to breathe so every time step Every minute you're getting six inputs Into your system the baby's sleep Patterns in one of those States and

Potentially is it breathing or is an Operating okay so you're trying to do a Correlation of these sleep Six States Into these two output States got it so Remember we talked about input and Output so that's what you're trying to Correlate and then you're trying to Build an algorithm can it predict one of Those two states sleeping or not Sleeping from one of the six states of Sleep so so this is fun but by the way What I've just taught you is AI the Mathematics of AI it's an input pattern Coming in and an output pattern and can You can you predict that output based on A particular input You guys got it so are you using a Special program or is it so we would Build algorithms to do that so the Algorithm Varies by the field that you're in okay So at the heart of this is statistics Yeah that is Currently being used so what way by the Way you could model this is you take a Bunch of inputs you look at the output And then you build a pattern right of Prediction yeah after a while if the Inputs and the outputs so get so you're So good at doing this you can and and The math is no longer based on Probability now listen carefully or Statistics it's based on an equation It's called a law it's not even so for

Example let's look at everyone's Probably heard of equals mc squared Einstein's equation energy equals mass Times the speed of light squared or f Equals m a Newton's equal one of Newton's Laws force is equal to mass Times acceleration Well How did Newton come across that well he Literally that's called a law it's not Statistics Is that he literally had a table I put An X-Force right I saw y acceleration Right and mass was a coefficient Okay so like this he built a table And then he saw this pattern hey every Time I increase Force acceleration goes Up But it's a function of the mass Right so if I have a body with you know Mass x right you know keeping the mass Constant and then he changed it so that Was something so f equals m a is Literally a law okay so the question is If you have a snake coming at you should You run well that's a little more Complicated can you build a law around That potentially if you see enough Snakes right and you and you see Poisonous non-poisonous let's say those Are the two outputs so what neural Nets Were are actually away everyone uses the Word artificial neural Nets you'll hear All these these nerds will use all these

Complicated language but ultimately Statistics okay they're just doing Probability statistics the problem with The Nerds is they try to make themselves More important than they really are all They're doing is statistics and and in Fact the field of AI is Ben frankly a Fraudulent field in the sense because It's been filled with people who've Basically been doing statistics for a Living and they've been branding it as Different things because they get tenure And they get professorships Etc yeah That's a very simple way of it's Statistics okay now the FL so and it's a Way of doing pattern analysis so think About it broadly these people are doing Pattern analysis think about the snake Analogy snake is coming should I run or Not okay so what is pattern analysis so Pattern analysis you can break it down Into three fundamental boxes so if you Have a piece of paper if you have a Piece of paper right now you can put the Piece of paper in landscape mode and in The in the far left draw one box in the Middle draw another box in the far right Draw another box okay and what you have Is you have three things that you need To do to be able to do pattern analysis And I'm basically teaching you what you Probably would not have the opportunity To learn if you took it a course at any Of these big universities they make it

So complicated that you would probably Leave because they made it so Complicated but part of my doing these Podcasts is make stuff simple because I Believe academics have a racket out of Making things complicated but those Three boxes so the first box on the left You can put in the word feature Extraction I'll tell you what that is Feature extraction the middle box you Want to put in the word clustering and The Box on the right you want to put Learning okay feature extraction for our Left box clustering and learning so Let's go back to the snake coming at you Okay what is feature extraction feature Extraction is called the art of pattern Recognition it's the art clustering is Once you get features how do you cluster Them into different groups and learning Is how do you learn from those clusters Now what I just said probably doesn't Make sense but it will shortly so I'll Give you an example so you can see this Is many many years ago for example the CIA and the NSA and the government and You should listen carefully it has lots Of tools out there we have cameras Everywhere they can take someone's Picture and they have it saved and they Do facial recognition Okay so if you Look at someone's picture how do you Know that's this person or that person Okay how do you determine that this is

Quote unquote AI or pattern analysis Well one way you could do it is you take A photograph so think about you take a Photograph when with your high Definition iPhone well think about that When you take that picture it's a Thousand pixels by a thousand pixels Okay in full color which could be you Know 64 bits of information a lot of Information just in one picture well Each little so if you think about 64 I'm Sorry a thousand by a thousand so what Is that one million little cells and Each little pixel has color information In it right so you could build a Database a huge database of everyone's Image which would cost you a lot of Information to store and then then you Could start applying image analysis Filters to do that right well that's the Way people are doing Imaging but there's A simpler way to do this problem if you Follow these things a feature extraction Clustering and and learning so let's say You wanted to take a picture of someone And your pattern analysis or your AI job Marcelo and Richard let's say you guys Were hired as AI engineers build me a System that could take someone's picture And tell me are they Chinese are they African-American are they you know Occasion are they whatever race right How would you do that well one is you Could take the images and do some really

Hardcore analysis but if you take the Feature so first step is feature Extraction so it turns out you don't Have to save a thousand by thousand a Million pieces of data it turns out that The art of pattern recognition is Extracting a few set of numbers that you Could reuse in the clustering process so What they found was you could take the Distance between the eyes how many Numbers is that just one number you Could take the distance between the lips Another number the distance between the Tip of the nose to the bottom of the Chin another number the distance between The ears like this you could basically You just need 10 numbers okay these are Called features they're not having to Store every little pixel every image You're getting the picture and then You're doing what's called feature Detection you write algorithms that can Find where the ears are and you say okay The distance between the two years is Five inches save that for Marcella the Distance between marcelo's eyes is three Inches okay so those 10 features are Enough digital Well first you save those 10 features Right so now you have a big database of People's features all right then You start doing clustering meaning you Start saying oh the Caucasian people all Have this distance measure so you

Basically have a little think about an Excel spreadsheet right uh imagine for Every person you have 10 numbers so if An Excel spreads you so if you say oh When they have this distance Statistically between their ears and This distance between their eyes Etc They look like they're a Caucasian when They have this distances they look like They are Chinese because you have you Can store this up right in a huge Database so is you or humans making Those uh yeah so you would initially Create what's called a training set okay And so that training set would be used To Cluster so think about a cluster is Like imagine you're looking up in the Sky and you see a couple of big clouds Right those clouds are called clusters So one big cloud is the Caucasian Cluster another cloud is the cluster of Asian Americans right or Asians another Cloud I don't know if I'm being Politically correct here it doesn't Matter but whatever if you have these Clusters and in those clusters you have The data points of people who are Fitting certain measures you already Know a Chinese person and then you look So that's the clustering so you're just Putting people into those clusters Because you know they're Chinese and Then you do a learning you say wow isn't This interesting the people who are in

The Chinese cluster all have this common Distance Okay where the people in the Caucasian Cluster so now you're learning So right so first you identify features You already know This person's Chinese so you're putting Them into these clusters and then you Write algorithms which measure these Distance measures it's called similarity Distances which is basically statistics That's interesting that you say though Are of the what did you say the art of AI or the art of pattern recognition is Feature extraction it is it's called Feature extraction because one Guide May Figure out these 10 numbers another guy May say I'm going to store all 1000 Pixels yeah right another guy may say I'm going to store 50 numbers yeah right So the art is what's a minute because The the minimum set of features you get Is going to make your Computing faster Right so obviously in law enforcement They probably want future extraction Done really fast so if you're doing you Need more computing power Etc so feature Extraction is the art what are the right Features clustering is you're you have Some ability to because you have some a Priori knowledge which means knowledge That exists and then the learning is You're saying oh look at those distances Between for those features they all seem

To have this pattern you follow so in This case the input to your system So Eventually how would you create an AI System you take a picture right run it Through your feature extraction module Which is the first module on the left Which takes a picture calculates these Distances 10 numbers feeds those 10 Numbers to your clustering process which Stores them and then your learning Process says oh The it does the analysis and then by the Way once in a while you may find Something new let's say you finally had A Native American which you'd never Coded for that would say hey this is a Whole new cluster and then you you're Learning so well what's new about this Native American cluster and then you Would learn and you would put that back In your algorithm so there's feedback This is I basically taught you AI That's It and then I guess the bigger picture Is what is that all getting used for Right some of that might be meaningful And useful but then some of the other Stuff it's like what do we really need This data do we really need to find it Yeah so it's a good question so so once You start learn you you acquired lots And lots of data and as your system gets Better and better and better by the way This is called confidence level so when You're doing these so when these AI

Systems are being trained initially your Accuracy is probably like nothing right And then your accuracy increases and it Gets better and better and better Eventually your AI system this system is Doing as good as a human being or even Better because it can notice subtleties Like you can have Chinese people who Grow up in America versus Chinese and China like you can start splitting these Clusters and even finer clusters but so I'll give you a couple of examples that I've worked on that shows you that you The same process you apply so I gave you The example it's set in infinite Syndrome well same thing what we noticed Was the features there were the states Of sleep right those are the six Features the different states of sleep Over time many years after I did that Work when I first came to MIT there's a Very interesting phenomenon called Tadoma T-a-d-o-m-a probably you've never heard Of that word but it's how deafblind People communicate think about if for a Second if you close your eyes and you Are deaf and you cannot see how do you Communicate with another human being Helen Keller if you remember was Deafblind so deafblind people if you go To see a deaf-blind person or you want To communicate if they learn this Technique called tadoma they're able to

Actually understand you and what so There's a speech processing group at MIT 1983 and MIT used to have this thing Called Europe's undergraduate research Opportunities program I think I Mentioned to you in podcast one how I Work with Chomsky to understand the Caste system when I first came in but One of the other europes I did was to Understand how to Domo work again I was Very interested in understanding pattern Analysis so here what happens is in Tadoma the deafblind person takes their Hand and they put it on your face and Interesting enough they put it on your Face Um so they're actually getting different Signals and the purpose of our research Project there's a guy called nat door Lock which was the faculty sponsor and I Was working with a graduate a graduate Student called Greg scarda who was doing This for his master's thesis and I was Just helping these guys out doing the Signal processing so the idea was to Find out what are these people listening To because they're actually able to Understand you are they is the other Person talking the other person is Talking okay so there you That's one what do you think Richard Yeah so what are they listening to well Let's just step back it turns out that One square inch of your finger pads have

More sensors than your retina So think about that you ever hear the Thing you can you can look but don't Touch yeah there's something to that Because your fingers are amazingly Sensitive so what so what we found out Was they were actually listening to Seven different signals so when they put Their hand on your face they're Listening to The your upper lip moves up and down Your lower lip moves up and down but it Also moves horizontally so there's three Signals there they're actually able to Sense where your tongue is the position Of your tongue on the palate okay They're able to also understand your Breathing and your jaw movements so it Adds up to around seven signals so by Purely putting their hand on your mouth They're able to capture seven signals so What we did in the lab was we literally Created a device but first of all we Actually brought in people had them Speak cat dog Mouse and and actually had Their waveforms and they were actually Measuring these seven signals so we were Creating a database and we were using These features these seven features to Map to Cluster to these words you Following me so here the cluster were Words and we have the seven signals and Then we were doing learning to figure Out how these seven signals match to

Actual waveforms of individual words so As you did more and more and more of This training we literally had one of The guys in the lab that actually built A retainer year it was a very Interesting retainer you put into People's mouth and the top of the Retainer could measure the tongue Position so he knew where every tongue Position was we knew the waveform of Their breathing upper lip movement the Lower lip but we had all these seven Signals just with what that person was Doing then we were matching those seven Signals to the words so here the signals Were seven waveform signals being Matched to I don't know 20 000 words in The English dictionary okay so they Didn't have to do all that to learn that So how did they learn what they were Doing so the human brain so the thing is Exact great question so the human brain Is doing this learning and we were doing This learning on the computer yeah okay But how did they learn it in the first Place yeah well so how is a brain doing That so there's different theories about Learning one of the modern theories is That's that the brain actually has Computing centers like it actually has Computing and it actually may be framed Around an artificial neural network that You give it an input and you give it an Output give it an input let me give it

An output so for example when you're Learning to ride a bike you're learning And you say oh when I distribute my Weight that way I keep going forward Oops when I do that I fall so the brain Is getting inputs and outputs inputs and Outputs inputs and outputs just like Those Chess Masters you give them over And over and over again they learn and The Brain learns to generalize okay when It sees some other pattern that normally Then occur it's actually able to even Learn from that so the the one of the Theories is that it's through things Like what by the way this is called Multi-level non-linear regression Basically a bigfolutin term to mean your Brain is doing probabilistic Calculations and it's learning and Learning and learning so it turns out That again repetition is a mother of Skill I think I mentioned to you that I Think there's some guy wrote a book I Don't know who it was uh if you want to Learn something do it 10 000 times right Um so if you want to learn to be a great Tango dancer do it ten thousand times Now some people can do it five thousand Times some people seven thousand but There's a certain number of repetitions You have to do that you can learn and That's by the way when you train neural Networks um that's what you're learning To do so for example in 1993 yeah I

Wrote a paper with a number of other Colleagues at MIT on handwriting Recognition so if you I don't know how Many of you write a bank check anymore Paper check but if I were to write you a Check for a hundred dollars I put Marcelo guardiano and you know in the Little box I put one zero zero point Zero zero and I put and I have to write 100 XX slash right so the net uh National West Bank in uh Western Bank in Um London had funded a project that I Headed up to create a neural network System to see if you could take a back Check scan it and could I predict the Exact number like 100 bucks because Everyone right different handwriting so How do we do this well first of all we Had to do the feature extraction right Which was to be able to read that box on The check and extract out the number of Digits that was a feature extraction and Then we had to do feature extraction for Each digit because people write some People just write a one with a straight Line other people put a little hook on It and write it write zero so how do we Get all the possibilities we actually Went and got Census Data turns out the United States government saves when you Fill out a census all your handwriting So we had a big CD disc of all the ways People write the number one all the way People write the number zero because you

Just needed to learn that 10 digits Right so when whenever you drew that Digit we learned the stroke sequence so We didn't have to change all the learn All the pixels and we saved those stroke Sequences for each digit clustered them And we trained the system so it could it Got very good right 98 99 accuracy that We could figure out a zero or one Etc Anyway so I built this whole system and I remember this was in the 90s I had to Go do a demo I was literally through Heathrow Airport from Boston carrying a Huge scanner on my backpack with the Computer and we went demonstrated it This is in 1993. and that was and that Paper was written in the international Journal pattern analysis and recognition You'll read it so so again we're using The same methodology for recognizing Handwriting same methodology that's Being used for analyzing tadoma so you Know for me this was a journey starting In 78 which SIDS in the 80s which sedoma In the 90s with handwriting recognition So in 1993 1994 I was very much into Pattern analysis and I came to the Conclusion that the whole field of AI Was a sham because everyone was doing The same things which was feature Extraction clustering and learning they Were all putting different terms on it To own their academic discipline so when You did speech recognition they called

It speech recognition other people Called it you know in their field and They're trying to and other people would Call it sleep analysis but if you looked At the fundamentals of this it was Future extraction clustering and Learning the statistics it's statistics So I said couldn't I build a common System that I could use a new technology A platform that you or Richard could use To recognize use it apply broadly to all Different types of universal problems Whether the signal coming in was a sleep Pattern of a baby whether this is when The signal was a handwriting thing or The signal was a document or speech so That was the basis of my thesis work Which I called information cybernetics So when I came to Emma so in 90 394 After I finished my masters I and and by The way my thesis never fit in any one Department it wasn't a mechanical Engineering piece it wasn't an Electrical engineering thesis it was an Immediate thesis right because I had Degrees in all those three so I tried to Create my own Department it was an Interdepartmental program it had to get Approved by the dean of the School of Engineering we had to fight for it and So I was doing that work starting in 93 And I was making Headway into creating a Whole new foundational base for doing Any type of pattern analysis problem and

While I was doing this I was called to Participate in a competition for doing Analyzing President Clinton's email this Too was a pattern analysis promise so if You remember 93 not Hillary Clinton Right no Bill Clinton now this is Bill Clinton And email everyone thanks Hillary yeah Right right this is to do so what Remember what I said the invention of Email uh the system as we know today Took place in 1978 an email was used in The office environment in fact in 93 When I used to do seminars a room full Of 1000 people yes how many people had An email account very few people had an Email account maybe two people but if You went to an office environment like Lotus or IBM people had email accounts And by the way you don't need the Internet for email people were using Email by interconnected computers right But in 93 if you remember something Interesting occurred the worldwide Webcam www which was up front end Graphical user interface to the internet Which made now the internet accessible To Everyday People point and click well When that occurred people started Creating web-based versions of the email System that I invented Hotmail Yahoo all These came out so what did that mean now Millions of people started getting email Accounts and millions of emails start

Getting sent so the white house before When people wanted to write to the President they would write a letter Dear Mr President I don't like your program On education Dear Mr President I don't Like your program on the Middle East Right or I support your position on Education right well when these letters Came into the White House physical Letters the White House believe it or Not had 104 47 buckets and these buckets Were termed education bucket drug bucket You know threats and for each one of Those buckets they had a form letter or Sometimes they would get routed and they Literally had a form letter so if you Send the president email you know I Support your policy and education he Would say thank you very much Marcelo And here's my you know they'd have Here's my real policy and they'd have a Staffer sign it and they'd send it out It was called the correspondent Management system so print mail set in They bucketed into one of those 147 Buckets and they'd send you out a print Mail well when email came the White House was being inundated Okay and they were using interns to do That and again I said probably shouldn't Use the word interns with Clinton but That's what they were doing then so as Email volume starts growing now think About what they would have to do that

Time lots of interns so now they're Getting way more milk because the email Is so much easier to send you don't have To put a postage on it so the emails are Coming in and guess what the Clinton White House is doing they are treating Email like print mail so in an email Came in they would print it out and then They would only answer back to those Emails which had a printed address so They print out the email they would look Into one of those 147 different buckets And they would send you back out a print Letter to your email seriously did not Think it would be easier to email them Back here no you have to understand People are they weren't ready for email Such a new thing that's what people Understand this was new yeah so the White House Runs a competition an AI Competition through the National Institute of Standards which used to run This conference call tax retrieval Conference which is like an AI Conference and six publicly traded Companies were invited I was the only a Graduate student which was because People knew I was doing something cool So I was invited to participate and this Is what the government did in this Contest it was a blind contest they gave You a bunch of emails and they gave you The 147 buckets so the emails are what Your input the 147 buckets your output

So you had to take those and there was Too many that you couldn't do it by hand Okay so you had to your system was Measured on its ability to take an email And would have put it into the right Bucket they already had scored the right Buckets so you're looking at certain Words probably well the input is a Document which is an email and you have To put it into the right buckets okay Well the long the long net of the story Was I use this technology I created Which was a multi-hybrid solution I Didn't just use one technique I threw Everything at it because I realized that All these academics were doing little Simple Solutions and then they were Blowing it up so I threw so in my Feature extraction I had like seven Different feature extraction methods I Had like 10 different clustering methods And I had three different learning Algorithms you see I I took an Engineering approach I wasn't wedded to Anyone approach and anyway long story I Ended up winning this competition so you Had to find a way to separate the emails Into each like one of the buckets so if You got an email they they already had Scored this email was about education This email was about this right yeah and Some of them were death threats and you And they had multiple different types of Threats so how did you figure it out

Well so I had built a set of ways to do The feature extraction right and what I Came to the conclusion was that every Email had an attitude every email had Different things people wanted every Email had a different type of object of Concern every email had different issues And every email always told what people Wanted so I found these five features Five to seven other features the art of Pattern recognition yeah so I I did that Art because I just had the aha moment I Said you know what when people write an Email they think they're writing to Someone they say hi my name is uh Bill I'm a CEO of a company President Clinton I really like your position on education I'd like to know what you're going to do For small businesses can my son get a Tour of the White House right and can I Come into speak people so there were Multiple issues in there so I figured Out that thing and I and I started Building clustering algorithms based on Keyword frequency and then I learned From that okay so I built this very Powerful system ended up winning and I In fact won one of the MIT still has This award called the lemelson MIT Awards MIT lemelson Awards and I was a Finalist that year with four other People it was pretty big honor to be a Finalist I think the year that I won Another guy built a flying car okay so

But I I was a finalist and after I did This my lawyer sachiva you can always do Your PhD and the internet is exploding And he said why didn't you leave and Start a company for a couple years so I Left MIT I went to MIT and I said look I Built this I did it on MIT time you have To give MIT the rights do you want can You give me a waiver so I said MIT said Ah we don't think it's going to go Anywhere you have to give them the Rights because you're working yeah Because I was a graduate student at MIT But MIT has a provision you go to them And their technology licensing the way Mit's intellectual property structure Works is if you develop anything and You're being funded I think I may have Gotten some Grant I don't think so I Don't think I I was even being funded by I was paying my own way through it yeah So but I still was in in following the Ethics I went to Lita Nelson I said Later I think I built something she goes I don't think this email management Stuff's gonna be important because Remember this is 93 they didn't know how Big email was going to be so they gave Me the waiver and I left MIT and I Started a company called Echo mail like The waves you know because one of the Areas of pattern recognition I was also Doing was a military project I was Working in a lab that was interested in

By the way when you build wings of Airplanes they're made with composite Materials and sometimes deep inside that Material some of the fibers can be Breaking so we used to send ultrasonic Waves into the thing and based on the Wave that came back could you predict What was going on without having to open Up a billion dollar Wing or 100 million Dollar Wing right right so that's why if You look at Echo mail the symbols were These three waves because we're sending So Echo mail was the company I started Just jumped out of MIT we had no Customers nothing and my first customer As I mentioned before I went 40 times Back and forth to at T convinced them to Use Echo mail you know and all I had was A core technology and built the software Yet and so they started routing all Their email to us and our technology Would analyze the email bucket it and Then we had humans review it and if they Said an email was correct we learned From that so our system got smarter and Smarter and smarter and we would get a Dollar 83 cents for every email we Categorized right 30 cents for every Email that went through the system and I Grew that to around a 250 million value Company and we sold a big piece of that In fact now we're going to relaunch that Company for small businesses it's called The AI in email but the point is that

The same approach I took to analyzing Emails the same approach I looked at for Tadoma was the same approach for sudden Infant net syndrome but the foundations Of AI or pattern analysis are feature Extraction clustering and learning so You've basically gotten course in AI you Know so when someone tries to highfalute You that's all it is and either you Should ask someone oh you're working on AI what are you working on are you Working on clustering methods are you Working on feature extraction are you Working on learning and they'll they'll Know you've sort of understood what They're doing you know yeah And but that's what people are doing They'll throw out big terms I'm working On svm I'm using neural Nets I'm using You know higher order clustering but They're using they're doing one of those Three things yeah they just try to make It more complicated yeah right but That's what they're doing okay so the Field is fundamentally that so I think You fundamentally I think understood the Foundations of AI from a technical Perspective I think there should be Another part added to that that we're Not thinking about is what's the bigger Picture to the AI like what is Recreating for Humanity is it something We should pursue or or not like is it Bad for society right shouldn't there

Yeah that's yeah so I think we've so now We've talked about the guts of AI now I Think again you guys should jump in on This part because I think now let's move To the what does this mean for you yeah And what does it mean for the future of You so what we're seeing is as Computing Has gotten better and better and better Because remember feature extraction Requires Computing clustering requires Computing learning requires Computing so As a technology gets better we're able To transfer more quote-unquote pattern Analysis methodologies with the human Being has to the computer across many Fields we talked about before we started Radiology in medicine a radiologist who Goes through umpteen years of Undergraduate um teen years of medical Training you know they're 10 years or Whatever of clinical training practice He learns how to look at a x-ray and Learns to predict okay does that person Have a brain tumor or not right well if That radiologist can be used to train a Machine through future attraction Clustering and learning you've Transferred knowledge okay you take Something like designing something as 3D Printing comes right as these new Technologies come can you actually take Soft skills how people do design another AI project I worked on at the media lab Was if you look at a a cereal box or you

Look at a poster someone's doing that Design we call a graphic designer so I Came up with the method that the system Would predict all different favorable Designs it would come back so you didn't Have to go through designs it would say Here are the best designs and you could Check one off right so the reality is We're going to be able to take a lot of Human skills and through this process of Future extraction clustering and Learning transfer to from what I call The carbon-based machine which is you to A silicon based machine which is Something outside of you so just think About that broadly and think about it That you can in fact transfer Potentially depending on your Viewpoint Of Consciousness from your brain to a Silicon-based brain nearly every major Country is running what's called a brain Project so what they're doing is trying To simulate they're saying if we get Enough neurons artificial neurons packed Into a computer and create all the Interconnections could we not create Consciousness so the theory in brain Sciences goes like this and this is an Age-old theory is it I think therefore I Am which means our I am therefore I Think meaning does existence precede Essence or does Essence precede Existence this is a whole Mind Body Problem so the spiritualist or the

Idealists argue no no there's something Separate from us than the physical body That gives us Consciousness the Materialists are you know that human Consciousness is a material artifact so If you take a slug you know one of those Slugs it only has about five neurons Human beings have millions of neurons And we have millions of interconnections So the argument is that you could create A slug on a computer or you could create A human being on a computer if you Connect enough neurons and you train it Okay so every major so the theory is if You could do that one could argue that If you're about to die this is sort of a Wild concept you could transfer your State of Consciousness everything you Are to a silicon paste machine that's if You're a materialist and if you think That the conscious yes is part of right So this is going to be the so so that's Not necessarily the case right that's What we don't know we don't know I I'm I'm so here's in 1994 when I was working On Echo mail I had I used to do you know I still do a lot of meditation and it's It's you know I'm very interested in the These other states of Consciousness so I Got up in the middle I was in this dream And in this dream I was sitting at a Table and at that table across from me Was a what looked like a robot and it Looked like a human being but I knew it

Was a robot and the question that came To me to answer this bigger question is What is the difference between me and That being across Sitting across from me and this is the Foundational question of pattern Analysis or AI because look if you look At the Arc of Technology let's assume One day you could create something that Looks just like you in fact can feel can Cry because there's a whole field of Computing now called Effective computing A f f e c t i v e which means computers You can actually teach them emotions so If you have in fact there's a computer That as you look at it if you smile it Smiles back at you you know so this is Let's assume that we're going to get Over all those technology hurdles that There will be something that looks like You talks like you and can pretty much Do everything you do And but it's not made up of you know Genes and proteins and blood and plasma It's made up of something else the Question is what is the difference Between you and that yeah and that's a Question that came up in the Stream and The conclusion I came to was that there Is fundamentally no difference like from A mechanical perspective Or from an electromechanical perspective From a even a intelligence perspective But the difference would be which of

Those creatures has asked the question About who am I Why do I exist And where do I come from And that is what I believe makes us Human so I would argue that that you Could have machines which may be more Human than what we call humans today but Even if the machines argued that they Wouldn't they would still be machines Right well this is this is an Interesting question so what are we a Machine like you know look my degrees in My phds in biological engineering and at Some point we'll do a podcast on When you actually look through a Microscope And you look at what we're discovering In biology man and you look at A piece of DNA And how that DNA opens up Physically opens up It sends out a piece of messenger RNA To the ribosome and that ribosome like a Little punch thing makes you know Proteins A freaking Factory and you look at that And you see this is pretty amazing that We actually are a machine a molecular You know going down to the molecular Level so I would now how did we get here I mean we could have arguments but let's Take this argument from a natural law Perspective that nature is this amazing

Engineer you can call nature God you can Assign It Whatever spiritual or Non-spiritual value you want but nature In a creative way like an engineer has Been testing and testing and testing It's been doing its own pattern analysis Throwing away stuff keeping stuff and It's created this thing we call the Human being which is made up of carbon And phosphorus and the different Elements but if you go at it man where It's a pretty amazing finely tuned Machine yeah and this machine has the Ability to extract features it has the Ability to Cluster it has the ability to Learn so the argument is if you one day Had Marcelo or Richard replicate it with Everything you can do in another machine What does it return to you and that Machine is there a difference And I would argue based on going back to Our second podcast what is a system are You an intelligent system are you an Open system an intelligence system takes An input and gives an output an Intelligence system has a goal it has a Mission and it is engaging in the world Through some goal to correct itself make Constant changes in the face of Disturbances and a struggle to achieve That goal so I argue that intelligence Is having a goal and working towards a Journey of achieving that goal through Struggle through disturbances that's a

Systems perspective I would argue that Anything is not human and is artificial That just takes an input and spits out An output so think about a number of Humans quote-unquote humans who think Quote unquote think who if they're Watching Fox News or CNN based on what they get Then they go pull the lever for Republican or Democrat just think about That they get an input they go do an Output input output and how many of Those human beings are asking setting a Goal for themselves I want to be a free Human being I want truth freedom and Health that's my goal and I'm going to Find that in the midst of all the noise And the disturbance I'm going to take Actions to find that for me so they set A goal I want truth or I want freedom or I want health and I'm going to take the Output of that what I see in the world And I'm going to engage in that to Interact with the world to get that for Me and then another set of human beings Get an input and an output so I would Argue that you it doesn't matter what What where that Consciousness resides it Could be in a carbon-based creature or a Silicon-based creature the issue is what Is that ability of that thing to go down That path and I would argue that we Already have ai which I to me AI is that Ability to take an input given output

Input given output what I'm stuck at Though is like if we do create conscious Creatures how do we know if they're Actually conscious right and like right So let's I think there's going to be a Sharp different like a sharp difference Between humans and robots that we think Are conscious right I think there's a Lot well give me well let me so in my Definition I would argue some humans are Robots already yeah yeah so so you you Look at look we had this thing when we Ran our campaign as you know called only The real Indian can defeat the fake Indian okay it was it was a it was what Is it it's like an image on some plastic Which had a picture of me picture of Elizabeth Warren and a headdress and it Said only the real Indian can defeat the Fake Indian so I presented that to some Quote unquote humans Some Humans they saw that input would Laugh Other humans would say hey what do you Mean by that I want to understand that Other humans would freak out and start Attacking us calling us racists calling Us names okay now I would say the first And the third group are robots the Second group wanted to understand that Is a human being so you you follow what I'm saying yeah input output so the Input comes in they already have certain Transport conversion and storage in them

Storage of memories and it's like a Reaction it's no different than a slug When I poke it in one way it goes this Way when I poke it in another way it Goes this way yeah and so my argument is That the notion of an input coming in You process in an output that's not a Human being remember we call that an Open system A human being or whatever you want to Call human-like intelligence is Something that has a goal in mind and I Would argue the level of Consciousness Is a refinement of that goal right yeah So you could call it enlightened you Know from the concept of Self-actualization an enlightened human Being his goal is not just to get food Or sex or own a piece of land or you Know make money yeah there's certainly In other words they're not that like Conditioned or brainwashed by the system So here's an interesting thing is They're actually questioning where their Goals even come from So this gets into this gets another Where do the things that I want so we Talked about an open system input output I would say that's a dumbest form of a Human or that's a robot you get the next One which has some goal and then you can Get into the quality of these goals so You have people you know when I was at When I first came to MIT there were the

Students would come to MIT and I would Argue and I give you two things I think You and I spoke about this I would Literally see these so-called Intelligent humans act like robots in my Freshman year these young kids would Come in 17 18 year old kids who look Normal they stood up straight they Talked with a certain tenor didn't have Any ticks or weird movements then they Would go see some Professor speak who Talk with a highly nasally voice had Some tixie be flailing his arm in a Little weird way like something was Wrong with him but therefore he must be Intelligent because he's idiosyncratic And eccentric and I swear to God these Students would start behaving like that Professor yeah I remember and speak with A nicely voice like this and flail their Hands and use their same vocabulary Right yeah you saw this I'm telling you Yeah you saw these people start Emulating another creature to be Accepted into this framework of now you Were an intelligent nerd so what do you Think it is that makes that the person Like question their surroundings and Step out of the the box there yeah this Is a good question you know because I'm Thinking maybe it's just like Um I don't know just like kind of Alienating yourself a bit from not Society but like the system maybe the TV

And right because that's when you start Thinking about yourself right you're not Like always yeah this is I think this is Like at the heart of the AI just like Meditation in a way where you have to Right be by yourself and really truly Think about where you came from and why You're here and what your goals and your Purpose in life I I think to answer this Question I think at some point someone Has to have some crisis I see okay some Crisis where they are forced with the Loss of something that they love Or they question their own death Or they I think it's out of losses where You start asking these questions I see Yeah so for me these questions came when I saw the loss of my own innocence where You know when I was five years four Years old where I'm playing with this Kid And I go to the mother's home you know Where this my friend I thought he was my Friend And the mother forces me to stay outside And gives me water in a different glass And calls me shudra which is like Calling me yeah okay in India Because we were considered that's when I Didn't even know what's going on that's What I considered there was this thing Called a caste system so I was open to That as a forefoot and then I learned my Mom was chased away like wait a minute

What what the hell is going on human Beings there's separation yeah that hurt Is what forced me to start questioning Everything like what the hell is this Here I'm playing with this kid and I go To his mother's mother mistreats me like This I'm no longer a human being you Took that path but then there's the Other path was which a lot of people Take which is almost like resentment and Saying oh that's the way things are so That's the way things are going to be But you as a little boy were like no Things can change but I think it was my Parents who had fought over that they Didn't believe in destiny so I think This comes to the Crux of the issues uh John Paul Sartre he wrote a book called Being in nothingness And Sartre he was one of the areas of Existentialism existentialism basically Says existence precedes essence Which means your existence from your Existence like you're born at a certain Point in time I was born in December 2nd 1963 when were you born November 17 1994. Richard when you were born January 21st 75 right so you're born at that Point so think about you're born you Come into this thing called the world Now you don't know anything that Occurred before that let's take a Non-spiritual perspective materialist Perspective for a second okay and that

May be an accurate approximation we Don't know but let's assume that right So at that point that you're born you Are now from the instant you were born One could argue that your entire life From that moment you get all these Constraints from society So if you're born into a Catholic Family You're supposed to behave like a Catholic you're supposed to do this and You're supposed to do that if you're Born into a Hindu family you're supposed To behave like this if you're born into An African-American family in a ghetto You see what I'm saying yeah so sarcher Talked about this and he gives an Example of a waiter Who he sees at a restaurant and the Waiter comes to serve him and he's Dressed to certain behaves a certain way And he behaves like he his head at All these mannerisms and he notices all The waiters do that like they have to Behave like that to be a waiter so what Happens is the fundamental Dragon here Which we all have to slay is that the Universe or the the world is trying from The instant you're born to control your Existence to minimize The infinite possibilities of what you Can be to a finite set of possibilities And the struggle of life is to recognize That The aspect of your existence is actually

Being an infinite human being there's You are not your past yeah you can be Anything and if you truly look at Marx Which a lot of people don't look at on The left or the right they don't really Understand this Marx was addressing The Human Condition in the first chapters of Dos Capital he talks about the notion That a finite set of people a very small Set of people get to live their dreams And the rest of us have to be controlled Like automatons so he's already talking About artificial intelligence so we need To move away from the single oh art of No Artificial Intelligence been here for A long time yeah and and so the issue Really here is that what sarger was Saying was that a you don't owe anything To your past that what matters is the Choices that you make the goals that you Set for yourself the dreams that you Have And one of the fundamental things is That Monopoly capitalism which means the The drive to purely make profit all day Long just is is essential goal is to Destroy the human being because it is About maximization of profit so why are We creating robots why did we create the Manufacturing line let's go to the depth Of it the economic analysis of it Because Henry Ford wanted to make a lot Of cars for a low cost so you could Maximize profit so remember basic

Accounting 101. Income net income is equal to revenue Minus expense Revenue minus expense in Any industry the number one expense is Labor so you're trying to take you sell A pen this pen I'm having for 10 bucks It costs you five bucks to make it how Much profit do I make okay so how can I Reduce profit well I get the materials Made cheaper materials could be one line In the expense or I make it cheaper well I go exploit someone maybe the material To dig up in America to make this pen Cost me two bucks but I can go over to El Salvador or Haiti and get it done for 10 cents so I'll do that and then I find Out okay everyone's going to El Salvador For tenses well now I'll apply machine Automation that can make it for a penny So what we're trying to do or the Capitalist model is you're trying to Lower the cost of goods and you're Trying to lower the cost of production Yeah so either so the goal ultimately if You're dealing with a human being you Want to treat them as a commodity yeah So you want to peel away any Humanity That they have so you do an assembly Line right yeah so you just become what Do you like he was saying a cog in the Machine and you of capital of capital And you lose the individualism because Everything's done for the corporation so Or for the maximization of profit yeah

So to be very mathematical about you Want to maximize profit yeah but like You just I'm thinking of any huge Corporation nowadays everyone gets so Caught up in doing everything for the Companies for the company for the Company you have to make it grow it's Like it takes a life form of itself it's An organism unto itself And that becomes the most important Thing in life right and you lose all That sense of individualism right and Well well the ultimate the ultimate form Of this this is what's going on right Now that forget even labor there are People just move money around all day Yeah they don't do they're so far Removed they're moving Capital around And they move by the way 600 trillion Dollars is our economy in the world so Think about every instant 600 trillion Dollars is being moved 600 trillion it's Unfathomable what that is yeah right so As that it's you know we think the United States by the way is 20 trillion That's our GDP but 600 trillion is the Amount of money in the economy so that Money is being moved there are people Who move money from point A to point B And make billions just from that Movement of capital they're not doing Anything productive yeah what you would Call productive work labor so that Movement of capital and there's machines

Now which are getting ready to do that Okay high frequency trading machines so Now you have algorithms competing with Other algorithms so the when you really Look at it the dehumanization that Monopoly capitalism affords is at that Level yeah and so talking about what Makes us human and relating that to AI Do you think we've gotten more conscious Because of like the internet and like All this information that we're Constantly exposed to or do you think We've kind of like dumbed down and Because everyone's like so caught up in Their phones do you think we're more Like yeah outputs to than ever well Let's let's think about it this way Right if you go back to what I just said About what is a focus of Monopoly Capitalism and let's talk about the Notion of this Machinery that's being Created okay So in my book the future of email I try To teach people that there's two Principles control and observability Controllability and observability just Sort of just think about those two words So the machine Wants to be able to observe you at all Times and be able to control your Actions for because it has its goal okay So the few who I don't want to get into A conspiracy theory but just think about The maximization of profit right so

Think about Edward Bernice a guy who's Known as a moderate modern guy of Advertising okay the entire goal of Advertising is to sell you something as Fast as possible And so there so what they want to do is To identify Groups of people who you can sell stuff To and then control their behavior so They'll eventually through a series of Interactions by something okay so in Order to do that you need to observe get Lots of data and then at certain points You need to control their behavior so They'll eventually go to in the case of Edward Bernice you know the guy who did Started doing some early cigarette Advertising drive you to go and buy buy A cigarette so some of their earliest Ads which they understood wow the Women's movement is coming let's have Women look strong you know and smoking Cigarettes okay we will take advantage Of this movement of the growing Independence of women because they Observe that yeah and move them towards Buying a cigarette showing smoking a Cigarette makes you independent so the Ability to do associative memory like That juxtapose two things to go to a Particular goal so observability and Controllability so those in power want To be able through as many many Um sensors as we talked about get lots

Of data so how did they get data before The internet came well they did surveys They call up people right they get Survey data put into a database and say Oh these people over in Massachusetts Like lobster okay to try to put Lobster Ads right oh these people down in Florida sunny environment they like Suntan lotions pretty easy right we'll Mark it suntan lotion to that well now It's more sophisticated now on the Internet with social media they can Watch every click you do everything You're viewing where you're scrolling Etc so now every one of us Some database there is an email address Of you some identifier and they're Collecting Oodles of information about Your behavior right and from that input They're extracting features feature Extraction they're doing clustering oh Marcelo guardiana a student right likes Journalism libertarian Richard Giorgio Cambridge resident you know independent Thinking right they're they're so They're clustering you and their watch Your behavior so now they have you Categorized which is clusters the next Step is controllability okay when Richard is doing this activity for Example on this website at this point I'm going to hit him with a particular Message and I know if I hit Richard like A t knows they have to hit people 17

Times with the message and they get an Output I'm going to hit Richard 10 times Five times they know it's called the Conversion rate so you are basically Being modeled you your Dynamics are Being known you are basically in the Larger World part of AI yeah okay part Of a larger pattern analysis system so How do you break from that well are you A particular cluster okay are you gonna Let yourself be observed are you going To let yourself be controlled because Ultimately the goal here is to think of You in one of those clusters yeah and Then manipulate that cluster so the idea Really comes down to what what about You're not in any one cluster what about Your many clusters what about you're More chaotic than they understood hey I May be an engineer but I also may be a Politician I may be a writer I may be an Artist I may be infinite that goes back To what we were talking about earlier About breaking these boxes that people Try to put you in right in the time You're born and now it seems like that's The the plan that's the idea is what you Just said to put you into a cluster it's That middle box I talked about now they Have to do it to maximize profits Exactly it's like now it's gotten way Worse than right to answer my question Right because it's gotten way worse and What we thought the internet was was a

Liberating medium could actually be a Vehicle now not an even centralize power Even faster yeah you see whenever new Technology comes everyone thinks oh the Printing press came I can all print Bibles we can all print our own Documents right like we we can all be Publishers well what ended up happening Is you created five major publishing Houses it's hard to get your book out on The New York Times bestseller unless You're on the end okay when the internet Came the vision was oh we'll all be able To get our knowledge out well now you Have Facebook and Google and Amazon okay In fact you could argue that you could Be wiped out faster now than ever before Which means I remove your name from a Google index Marcelo guardiana does not Exist so what we've done is we've seen The consolidation of power and the only Way to overcome this is to actually Become a true human yeah and this notion Of becoming a true human is a deeply Deeply important one because it means You have to ask who am I am I an American right am I a Cambridge resident Right am I this or that people have to Recognize that they have infinite Possibilities of what they can become And that they have to say I don't owe Jack to what I was born and what I Owe in the past because every to your Point every decade that goes by the

Manipulation is going on to when Richard Has a child or you have a child they Already know your past yeah I know they Know the trajectory of your children Right it's called Cradle to Great Marketing impossible to break in a way Because we're we're raising Generations Like this so the kids are going to see Their dad act like that and that's just Going to be the way well that's why the Only way out of this is what I call you Have to have it the new food the new Mana is not land bred or peace it's the Mana of Truth freedom and health which Is going to come from systems thinking People need to recognize that they need To start having a new framework for Thinking they need to recognize that Everything that they are comes from Observability and controllability and That they need to recognize that they Don't owe anything to their past meaning The past I'm not saying you don't know Anything to your parents or those kind Of things right but I'm taking from a Thinking perspective otherwise you are a Robot give you another example when I First came to MIT you know I'm an Indian American born here but there would be Indians who came from India The Graduate Students these guys were robots they Came up from India I've come to MIT I'm So happy to get in I'm the best in the World I'm going to get my graduate

Degree then I'll go back to India get in A Range marriage get married then I will Come here live here get my BMW I'm a Success done yeah they're on a freaking Program right total freaking robot yeah Would you say intelligent I call them Just basically educated idiots so what We're creating that is a stream of Educated idiots and even more Disconcerting these people actually Think they're intelligent yeah well That's what I call that artificial Intelligence that's how a lot of people Define intelligence nowadays If you know math science like how much Money you make but the other huge Question is though are the humans Becoming cyborgs So Elon Musk has talked about this a lot He was at first he was warning us of the Dangers of AI I know he's saying we need To integrate with AI in order to not let Us out let it out compete us right so we Have to all you see I ultimately believe When people come up with these ideas one Has to always question that person and Their surroundings well Elon Musk grow Up in South Africa where 97 percent of Whites controlled three percent I'm Sorry 97 three percent of whites control 97 of blacks I know he's telling Everyone what to do well I'm just saying You can't not he was part of the elite There yeah his family profited from

Exploitation of lots and lots of people So does that affect the sinking I don't Know but I I can't as a as an Untouchable from India I know that has Affected me so it would be so for his Thinking itself is comes from a notion Of human beings or Commodities and they Exist for maximization of someone else Houses capital so in South Africa a lot Of blood diamonds a lot of people mining All sorts of rare Earth mineral minerals While you know a lot of and by the way They also there were a lot of black People not a lot a black Strata who also Took advantage of their majority right Now what's going on in South Africa was They never had a good Revolution oh yeah They basically promoted numbskulls like Mandela who was basically a sellout and A whole nother discussion we can have You know I met people who were in South African prisons blacks and whites okay Mandela was considered a basically a not That smart of a guy the whites in South Africa promoted him just like they Promoted Gandhi in India to quell a real Powerful revolutionary movement and Instead they had this basically a bunch Of white people left and a bunch of Black Bourgeois came in and that's why You have all the corruption there they Never addressed the fundamental issues In South Africa of exploitation okay so Now they want to create the black white

Thing when it was really about massive Exploitation of Labor that's what Happened so now Elon Musk comes from That background so his view on labor and The essence of being human is that Driven by oh we're all going to be Cyborgs well that's a choice we have and This is something Star Trek talks about Too at any point each one of us has a Choice even our emotional decisions we Make so they want to remove there's no Choice Elon Musk says this yeah okay What any point we as Humanity have a Choice and that's something they want to Remove because that's part of being a Human being to recognize that you do Have choice in any instant and they kind Of want to ease you into that by getting You addicted to your phone right that's The start getting yeah yeah so so you Know Marx talked about that the goal Would be we would fight against the Machines we would separate ourselves When in fact what's happened is we've Become so close to our machines I mean You probably that's the first thing you Look at when you wake up as well like Everyone's guilty some people yeah I Think a lot of people now do yeah right So we've become so integrated to so the Issue is Will these machines then just Become part of us and to me this is Where the Deep deeply spiritual question Comes you see in the Indians or the

Indian or the Hindu spiritual tradition There is the concept of koshas K-o-s-h-a-s where they believe that There's the essence of who you are and Layered on top of that word these Different bodies so there's your soul Body then there's your etheric body There's your causal body the astral body And then the physical body okay so if You remove the physical body you you Have the astral body you remove the Astral body there's a causal body you Move the etheric body you come to the Soul body which is who you truly are Your true State of Consciousness when All these layers have been removed the Causal body represents your past I mean They're they're I mean I'm not gonna we Can do a whole podcast on that but the Notion was that who you are is something You don't even know who you are until You go inside yourself and you remove Yourself from the illusion of what you Think you are now here's the interesting Thing and I've thought about this so if You believe that concept we have these Different sheaths on ourselves like Different clothing we wear and most Human beings live in the physical body Now there are certain spiritual Traditions which believe you can peel Away those layers and you can understand Who you are in its Essence okay Different than what Archer proposed okay

But here's the idea suppose one day Richard and you may want to think about This let me pose to you that one day not In the too far distant future I give you A set of contact lenses all right where It is no different than your screen on Your iPhone but 3D yeah which we can do The Oculus but imagine it's just Embedded from the time a child is born It's embedded onto that child's eyeball And I give you hearing or it's injected In the fetus right Yeah so some but we know we can Definitely probably put contact lenses On yeah and I give you hearing that you Can hear things Not only locally but you can tune it to Anywhere in the world okay And then I have a hologram of you which We can do Holograms and they're getting Better and better and project you so now Richard I'm talking to you and I'm Wearing this gear and you're wearing the Screw Marshall and you are Richard how Do you know you're physically here and Let's say you grew up with this year Over year over year generation over Generation and this became the norm just Like the internet is going to fade into The background this too would fit you'd Forget about it yeah this would become I Could be a million years or a million Light years away but this room would Feel real because by the way they have

Haptic sensors where it can feel Physical thing so you would be you and I Would be in this room you could be a Holograph image that gets better and Better and better Fidelity and Computing Gets better and we would be in this room This is a real phenomenon I could touch Your sweater here feel it because I have Haptic sensors so here's an interesting Question how do we know this hasn't Already happened yeah that's exactly What I was thinking that we are because That's what the Indian Mystics argue the Indian Mystics argue the purpose of Existence to understand who you are and See things as they truly are sun Buddha Is one of his last great Um lectures he gave two lectures on What's called vipassana and annapana Meditation which he said the idea is for You to see things as they are and There's a meditative methodology he gave And what he said you would find is that Everything is impermanent that you are Covered with these sheets and this is an Illusion what we see so what let's say We did that okay and then someone else Did that on top of that this could keep Going on yeah and it makes me think Maybe at some point in time we only had One sheet Maybe that's how most people interacted And lived from a spirit yeah so then Over time all these different

Disturbances governments whatever people Say well they created different cheats Right it could create different sheets Which just became the norm which people Born nowadays they're they're kind of in A way like right away born with all These sheets or get away sheets over Time that's why we always like think of Children the way they think it's like Amazes us sometimes of like what they Say or like right how they think about Certain things right yeah so ultimately That's what this is about the people who Are writing a lot of stuff about AI a Lot of these people don't even know what AI is I think in this podcast you guys Have really learned that it's basically Statistics and it's trying to take a Minute a mechanical perspective the Other piece of AI here that needs to be Understood is that it is really an Opportunity to ask this deeper question As we're doing right here what does it Mean to be a human being and because and What choices are we going to make yeah Are these choices that that we are Making or is Elon Musk making it who's Basically concerned about being a Billionaire and leaving some Legacy Behind makes a lot of money off Government subsidies turned into like Our religion right People's brain into like a machine and Wherever you know that he lives forever

That's kind of a thought if they upload Their Consciousness into like this AI That we have to live forever and There'll be Gods it's kind of dangerous In my opinion yeah why do you think it's Dangerous Richard as we were talking Earlier this depopulation what happens When it becomes Too powerful And they want to start getting rid of Humans as you would yes so let's talk About deep so if if you go down if you Take capitalism To its full conclusion right Revenue minus expenses equals net income Okay so let's say we're in this phase One of AI deployment Phase one looks like this transfer as Much human Knowledge and Skills to Silicon-based machinery Okay so phase one ends where pretty much None of us need to work Meaning you have machines doing pretty Much everything mowing your lawn you Know being your plumber I mean you could Take this to anything right yeah pretty Much anything you need so now you have a Bunch of humans by the way you know we Have three economies right now we have One-third of people in the United States Do not work at all They don't work another third live in The gig economy Which is they do a gig contractors like

An Uber driver and the third third Actually still does work professionals Yeah and those three economies are Separating at light speed by the way So AI would support The definitely more and more people Would not need to work I mean you could Outsource a teacher you Could start Outsourcing a lot of stuff So you could then argue in phase two of This world of AI In a in a in a reason if it was a quote Unquote good model you work maybe one Day in a week to do creative stuff or Something that Society needs okay and The other six days you get to hang out And just be creative because the only People need it would be the ones the People working in in Ai and AI making The AI better and that kind of and Eventually AI would self itself manages AI see it on machines managing machines So that but somewhere let's say that Happens right now those in power who Actually own all of this Machinery to do The AI are going to say why do I Need all these human beings who are just Like not doing anything That's what the way they would see it That's if the AI hasn't already taken Over well yeah right or if the AI hasn't Taken over or to your point those people Become part of AI because they become Cyborgs right yeah so they become

Machine-like and then you so you have The complete Fusion Of the Silicon creatures with the Previously carbon creatures who have Enough money to become silicon creatures Right because as you said a guy these Guys billionaires would say I'm gonna Live forever I'm gonna Basically transfer my Consciousness and I'm going to control all the means of Production like so Amazon Jeff Bezos Basically his brain is in Amazon okay Or he may have choices people may have Choices I may transfer my body into a Physical body or other bodies I mean There's all sorts of combinations of This yeah so they're going to wake up And say well why do I need all these Other seven billion people Everything's being done I mean I got I Got my farming done I got this done I Got all these machines why do I need These people That's the question that's going to come Up oh the pollution's getting worse we Have too many let's depopulate and it's More likely to happen if we if humans Actually do integrate with robots and Become cyborgs because the robotic like Way of thinking would be like yeah like You're saying they're useless they're Polluting the humans are polluting the Earth so let's kill the ones that are in Cyborgs or right just kill most of them

So right so more for me yeah right so if You look at what's going on with Countries like Africa China very wealthy Billionaires and I I I I have some guys That I know are very wealthy Billionaires and I've been watching over The last 10 20 years they've all been Going to Africa You know under some claim that they want To help the hair with malaria or They want to help them with their water Problems or help them with their food But what if you follow what they're Doing many of them set up non-profits And they're buying huge tracts of land Resources yeah all so so Africa is like The next big Wilderness yeah for them to Own for themselves and their kids yeah And they know that and they know that so It's like the next West right think About it massive amount of resources Beautiful lands Etc So you have to really start wondering What these people's goal is what is Their intelligence Where do they want to take this And I think the purpose of this podcast Is to really start Empowering you to realize at any point We as humans have choice We can choose to what technologies we Want to implement what technologies we Don't want to And the military-industrial academic

Complex works together for its own Existence So military to words and we call the Industrial complexes these massive High-tech companies and Academia Academia is essentially a bunch of very Narcissistic Frankly a lot of robots Who are not so smart but were robots who Serve the military-industrial complex to Preach to others how great all of this Is going to be For themselves frankly and mostly view The world in a reductionist way in a Reduction in a reductionist way in a a Way that profits in military industrial Academic complex remember most of these Academics what's happening Academia has Become robotized yeah the old days of Academia giving tenure Was that it would be a place for free Speech and you'd get to talk a lot of Stuff but now in the seven years from The time you've become wanting to be an Academic they get rid of all the Riffraff they get rid of all the rabble Rounds when we end up with a bunch of Robots in Academia itself So we're basically creating robots so I Think that's what we really want to Really leave with is you the future of You depends on the choice and Recognizing that you have choice you Know what choices you make for you and

Ensuring that at any point are you Getting more truth are you getting more Freedom are you getting access to Control your own health and if those Three questions are no you're heading Towards to this world of massive Exploitation it almost seems though like If the whole system is going down that Path there's is there I mean you could change it for your Family but for Humanity can you change It because I mean going back to Modifying your kid seems like all Parents are gonna want to do that I Don't know I was going to ask you this Like if you had a kid would you actually Would you do that like yeah so this is Now into genetic engineering yeah yeah Because now like I was looking at the Stat of how many kids Young Americans Are on Ritalin and it's 4.5 million Which is like it just keeps on going up Enough yeah and for parents it's very Easy for them to not think of the side Side effects and just give it to them Just so they could compete with the Other children they think they're Competing and I feel like that's if That's what the future is going to be Like you can modify your kid you can Make him have a 300 IQ 300 level IQ so Why not do it all the other parents are Do if are doing it and if I don't do it My kid's not going to be able to compete

With the other kids who got it or be Able to get a good job so everyone's Gonna do it like we see that pattern With Adderall and with a big Pharma is There anything we can do I mean is don't You see the future well again it comes Down to what the goal is right yeah so There's a there's a paper that just came Out written by the scientist who looked At 25700 Gathering societies By the way hunter-gatherer what they Call the quote unquote the noble savage It's funny there was a yesterday I was Watching a show on the Hudson people H-a-d-z-a Who are still the last remaining Hunter-gatherer societies one of the few That remain like this and they had all These people from these Elite Institutions go study was hilarious to Watch because these people are just Looking at them thinking they're a bunch Of idiots and the way these people are Talking about them in the documentary Makes them look like a bunch of morons It's just the way they're talking so hey They know better and just the way They're talking this high level Intellectual nonsense my point is this That hunter-gatherers societies but this One if you looked at their health They had their some of the key they were Getting higher macronutrients higher Micronutrients low you know they ate low

Glycemic index Foods they had a higher Base alkaline base they had their bodies Were more alkaline I mean you go down There's about it was a multi-system Model of Health none of which we follow Right now so we have moved the whole Area of Health Into manufactured products the stuff That we put in your mouth they ate very Little salt right it's a completely Different world and all this is came From the time when we moved away from a Hunter-gatherer model when we employ Technology to domesticate animals and we Created this they lived a very rough Life probably But they had Community they had other Things that we don't potentially have Now they could have been happier in General they could have been happier so The issue is what is the goal is the Goal maximization and profit Or is a goal maximization of something Else you call happiness yeah with so What is what are we trying to maximize So that's really the fundamental Question and that's the struggle you Have with technology and the medical Field right is like trying to actually Help people and not get caught up into Trying to make right right so what I'm Saying is so this leads to the farther Question is we think human beings know Everything so this comes down to the

Singer of the concept of as we talked About in the last podcast the concept of A human-centric world view So we have this notion that we know Everything That or maybe forget even getting to the Spiritual thing just from the mass of The universe how big it is how billions Of years it's or trillions it's let's Say billions right Our existence is like a little small Little Probably you know single frame In in a movie that goes on for millions Of years yeah so are we saying that we Know how the the natural laws that Created us we know how to manipulate Those laws better than nature you see This is the outstanding question Are we a part of something that goes Where we're not the creator of Everything that we think that's around Us maybe it's a systems way we should Look at life there's an interaction Between us the Rock You know the land and the animals around Us And that our thoughts even come from That yeah right so so so where does this Understanding come from and I think this Is the open question and and who's Deciding all of this for example do we Even know the origin of where human Beings came from well the way the

Academic model works you get a you get To win a Nobel Prize the first one who Writes it well how do we even know what Their writing is true anymore yeah Because if the motivation is to get Federal funding and you get more grants How do we even know their ideas of what They're writing is even true yeah on These soft areas like anthropology and Sociology et cetera because the Motivation so Harvard is the expert in The origin of human species well we Don't even know there's a lot of Evidence that says there's like lost Civilizations and that civilizations Have come down immediately people try Credit the academics like get really mad When you bring that up right right that May be human existence like everything Else itself is a cycle maybe humans Existed we hit a peak point we destroyed Ourselves and we went back and this has Been going on at it's not a exponential Curve that just keeps like this guy Ray Uh one of the guys was a Google CTO says Oh you know we're going to hit Synchronicity and really hurts well yeah Very curse well so this is a very Human-centric concept that we will keep Growing and growing and growing as and Expanding well maybe there's a limit to At a point where we destroy ourselves And this is some scientist that maybe The human brain is itself too clever for

Itself that maybe the real cleverness Comes in saying oh we shouldn't go Beyond that yeah you'd like we should Not develop those things maybe that's The real intelligence and the ones that Keep developing and growing they do Something that's against nature natural Law and they just destroy themselves and They just keeps going into the cycle Maybe Maybe the cultures that eventually do Meet one another are the ones who found This range of existence where you Actually make a decision you know what We're not going to do that yeah like Yeah we can do that but we're not going To do that right like they actually know Where to stop yeah I was thinking I Don't know what you see what I'm saying Maybe that is a technological like a Hyper true intelligence well that's what Would make us true humans is actually Thinking about that and actually doing Something to stop it right because I was Thinking about it in terms of like GMOs As well it's like we know we can modify The food it's going to be cheaper but we Also know that there's going to be some Side effects like not good effects for Humans and I was thinking about that in Terms of like AI as well it's like you Can modify yourself to have 400 500 IQ Maybe in the future but is that really Smart like what's that going to lead to

Is there going to be like a default or Something like well the issue is what Does it mean to be a human yeah and I Think we need to really think about this What does it mean to be human and I have A much more open understanding of it and We cannot have that I'm saying my end Point is we don't even know what it Means to be human forget freaking AI We don't even know what needs to be Human because from the instant we are Born we are constrained so the only way Way out of this is that we need to Remove all those barriers which stop us From being human yeah which is a Military-industrial academic complex Because the military-industrial academic Complex is the cyborg which exists for Its own Perpetual growth and it's the One that needs controllability and Observability Or that inner voice inside of you that Says you can't do this right which is Maybe based right off of like Society or Your parents or whatever they can right But it's clear that human beings do well When they have a sense of community yeah In terms of their own health physically Mentally emotionally I mean the number Of psychologists I think over the last 20 years there should be like 4 000 Marriage counselors now there's 40 000 And you have divorce which is you know What maybe marriage is changing and all

Those relationships are changing that's One view but my point is it's not like Therapists have helped Humanity come Together Right it's ultimately going to be the Bonds that the interconnections that People develop yeah inside their Community so what that what the system Wants you to do it wants you to develop Interconnections to it yeah it wants you To be connected to it versus another Human being it wants the government to Be your parents in a way that your mommy Or them yeah you know so because that's Where profit comes from so the issue is You take is I think this is a central Decision That people should make and people Should start thinking about Because and who is making those Decisions for them You know this is why I think it's really Going to come down to this fundamental Issue of centralization Of whatever you want to call it Intelligence versus decentralization Yeah You know if you think it's going to be Inevitable that we're going to be Merging into machines well who's making That decision You know yeah that's because yeah I mean For me personally at first that's what I Thought and then actually like doing a

Bit more research and actually thinking About it more Um I changed my mind I was like is this Really a good path for Humanity and Ultimately it doesn't look like it is Yeah it's it's gonna be a good path Again it comes down when we talked about In the previous part what is the goal Here yeah what is the goal And that's what we got to think about And so fundamentally artificial Intelligence doesn't think about the Goals Human intelligence what makes a human Being a human is they're actually Sitting and reflecting and thinking About what is the goal And if you don't think about what is a Goal you're probably more than likely Already bowing down and you're probably AI yourself yeah that's what I think We'd like to end with think about are You a human or are you a robot And whether if you're a robot it's going To be easy To put you into a silicon body and you May want that and then what does it mean To be human And what does it mean to evolve you know Is there Evolution or do we have choice These are some more of the deeper Questions that we need to ask and who is Making these decisions for you are you Making these decisions or are these

Decisions already being made for you if We want to combat this in a way we have To Start being a bigger part of our Community right what do you say as well I mean yeah that's why I think you know I think the entire emphasis people Should start recognizing is that there's Something to be said about Um a recognizing that there is a set of Robots Who want to centralize power and they And they thrive on centralization of Power like they know it all and I want To call them robots actually I would say That we already have a bunch of Carbon-based robots running around Because some of them are conscious of The fact that they're doing that right Yeah yeah they're they're actually Conscious of very people on top yeah Yeah and they understand systems and They know what they're doing you know so For example you know I live in this Neighborhood here you know you know it's Uh it's an interesting neighborhood in The 40s there was a guy called Carl Koch And another guy called Walter gropius Who part of the Bauhaus movement who Very interesting artistic movement and They built these homes here for five Thousand bucks at a time in the 40s when People are building these huge ornate Homes and they went and built simple

Homes which were affordable recycled Material which was unheard of in the 40s Where Carl Koch was almost kicked out of Cambridge for his avant-garde ideas this Was an artist community of people very Different I would call human beings well Now I look around me there's a bunch of Robots who live here you have one guy Down there was an MIT professor it was a Robot another MIT professor over here a Robot you know guys a hedge funds Manager over there is another robot Another guy next door who's who's a Robot who just lives off his family Money yeah you know a bunch of robots Living on me and it gets interesting When I put my sign down at the bottom of My hell it should achieve it for Senate Right the one of the robots came to my Door and he said oh he wanted I didn't Want to talk to him because I knew why He was coming well several years he's Put up his Another robot sign there was a Democrat Who ran I was running as an independent And he called up all the other robots to Try to convince him my sign should get Taken down and it wasn't even and we Didn't even have real Indian fake India Now what what why was that because the Concept I was a new guy maybe it's a Indian guy dark skinned Indian guy and The only up here who's running That I'm running as an independent I'm

Attacking their friend Elizabeth Warren All of these didn't compute for them I Think the very thing is you're not in The box I'm not in a box right and my Point is that there are I would argue That we already live in a world of AI And so it is going to come to a battle Of machines versus robots and we're Already seeing that set of robots who Say I'm left you're right Yeah I'm I'm I'm this or that and I Think the real question is or the real Insight I think that we can leave this Podcast with is we already live in Artificial intelligence people who are Simply taking an input and putting out An output I'm a Democrat Elizabeth Warren is for the common man right Donald Trump is a racist whatever you Want to go down whatever the flavor of The month is right the Republicans are Like this Democrats are like this right Splitting people up into little buckets Right and that Segregation of people oh if you're a an Engineer you must be like this if you're A journalist you must be like this Separating people out and then Controlling them and I would argue that The real issue is people want Centralization of power on Decentralization more fundamentally the People are human fighting robots yeah People are thinking input output that's

Really the bottom line it is yeah and we Can change it that's another key we can Change it it's not too late by breaking From that by saying you know what I'm Not going to listen to 30 second ads Yeah on TV anymore exactly I'm not going To vote for a Democrat or Republican Vote for this two-party system that's Part of becoming a human being I Purposely stopped watching commercially Years back like right just like tune out Or turn it off completely and then when The show came back on it would turn out Right I am going to on my own trying to Understand how systems work I am not Going to listen to left or right I think This is probably the biggest saying Someone this is a decision look one of The biggest things we have in human History right now that never existed Before is human suffrage do you I mean Nearly everyone in the world can vote Now now I'm not saying who you can vote For is good but there was a time when we Were just slaves there were time when we Were serfs yeah but this has occurred And this is an interesting opportunity Yeah it really is right so those in Power they go one step forward and they Try to put us two steps back so they Created a two-party system to try to Force us back into the machine and one Of the most important things people can Do is to recognize that they don't owe

Anything to this two-party system that They need to move Beyond left or right And they recognize that we've been given An amazing opportunity to actually Choose how we want to live our lives Exactly like these like this time period When we have the freedom to go on the Internet to think by ourselves we're not Slaves anymore but we're still Coming into this time of age where Everyone's addicted to their phones and When it seems like people are becoming More of slaves by and maybe by being Addicted to their phones and maybe Becoming cyborgs so yeah we should make These we should make AI a servant to us Which means the robot human or other Quote unquote in carbon form should be Servants to humanity yeah so for example You can argue that yeah technology so For example we got rid of travel agents Per se right but now if you were a Travel agent before now you can go do Things online well maybe you could be a Real travel agent like really recommend To people what's healthy for them where They should vacation you see what I'm Saying like be a True Advisor one of my Good friends at IBM had an interesting Insight he said there will be two waves Of the internet the first wave would be Everything would get automated but it Goes the second wave is going to be more Interesting where you get people want

Full service which means Humanity so That's the way we can choose look Everything to get automated so fine That's great but now the second wave Could be how do you use technology to Bring out your Humanity yeah right so You could say look wow I got all this Time I can find all these amazing places On the internet to travel to but what do I really want to do yeah where do I Really want to go right and same way hey Wow I could learn a lot of skills now Hey I want to learn Pottery I want to Learn programming I want to learn so you Could now become truly a polymath not be A jack of all trades or a master not That dichotomy right not a specialist But you could actually learn a lot of Stuff yeah so I think that's and the Issue is are we as humans going to make Those decisions and be truly human or Are we going to be essentially end up Being robots and be a slave to robots Because that's really the question are We going to be a slave to robots which Is centralized government a bunch of People who want to maximize profit all Day are we going to be humans and they Can be a slave to us or that methodology You see seems like it's emotion Important time it's the most important Time yeah it's it's really the truly the Notion of Independence and freedom and Truth and I think it's going to be a

Decision do you want to be ruled by Robots who already exist they're in Carbon-based creatures right politicians And the military industrial academic That is a robot yeah that is the cyborg Already it's already here it's been here Since the 1940s or do you want to be a Human being do you want to declare your Independence you want to declare your Humanity and preserve humanity and Preserve Humanity yep anyway thank you So I think this was a good discussion Yeah definitely all right thank you

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